May 30, 2008
The Murse: I'm Against It
I decided on the subway this morning that I am against the "murse," the man-purse.
If a man needs, as I do, to carry things around he should opt for something like a messenger bag, as I do, or a brief case, or a book bag. But he should NOT opt for one of these short handled deals that some thread over an arm and clutch in his pit. (Note: I'm not saying you can't have a bag with short handles, you just have to carry it like a brief case. And also, it can't be floppy and big like a purse.)
Example:
William Sledd, bless his heart, is exactly the sort of man I don't want to be and have little appeal to me.
Don't get me wrong: I do appreciate when those driven to flamboyant extremes do so with a keen eye to color, pattern, and all of that. I appreciate it because these people are perfectly aware of the almost evenly divided odds that observers will love or hate them and they persist still in expressing their joie d'vivre. If you're a man who aspires to be Elle's (from Legally Blonde) best friend, then go for it. I won't stand in your way, neither will I ask you out or trust you with my taxes.
These men lack gravitas and carrying a purse under their arms like that only produces the same effect that the tiny head of a chihuahua would have jutting from a gym bag has. It is an effect that says his concerns are shallow, insipid, petty, and silly.
I can be a bit of a dandy myself and I do like a bit of whimsy when it comes to my fashion choices. If I can find a shirt with a fun dinosaur picture on it, I am likely to buy it.
I think women can carry purses in this way because women are pretty and part of the feminine mystique, if you can forgive the accidental allusion, is how they can appear both simultaneously completely exposed and vulnerable but also completely capable of crushing you and doing your taxes. The smartly dressed lady is well-composed and graceful and fanciful elements in her ensemble, things like purses, bracelets, earrings, and high heels, only serve to emphasize her femininity while not -- if used properly -- making her look vapid and silly.
A woman with her purse clutched under her arm looks serious. She is going somewhere to get something done.
A man with a purse clutched under his arm looks ridiculous. He may or may not be going somewhere and accomplishment is rather low on his list of priorities. Like I said: he lacks gravitas. Just choose a different kind of bag if you have to carry a bag.
Oh, and William, you may or may not be familiar with the pocket options available in jackets, but they are quite useful when your pants are not cut in such a way as to accommodate your necessities. (When I can't carry my messenger bag or gym bag and I can't wear a jacket, I just carry fewer things. Revolutionary!)
And since I'm ranting right now about how I think it is at times inappropriate for men to adopt the fashion choices of women, I'd like to talk about pants.
I had this video for YouTube in which I rant about those stupid skinny pants that so many hipsters and otherwise oriented males are wearing these days, but the sound was bad.
And then I saw this guy wearing a pair of slim-cut skinny pants and I filmed him and remarked about how good he looked because his pants weren't actually skinny jeans, but slim cut pants and his whole outfit was very masculine, well-fitted, and frankly brilliant. But his pants had the effect that skinny pants are supposed to have and so I had to comment on how his pants were so much better.
And then a friend of mine erased all these videos I had made, but hadn't downloaded for editing yet.
Don't know what a skinny pant is? Well, they are very tight all the way to the ankle. They're what you think a heroin junkie wears. If your pants have a zipper at the bottom so that your foot can get through the opening, then you have a pair of skinny pants, a pair of skinny pants that is VERY serious about being skinny, actually.
A slim pant may hug the thigh and be fitted to just below the calf, but leaves room at the ankle.
I don't like the skinny pant because it emphasizes the width of the hips. If you're a lady, this is fine because ladies are curvy and hips are quintessentially feminine. It also calls attention to the smallness of the ankle in relation to the rest of the leg, which is appealing on a lady. When was the last time you saw a ballet dancer with cankles? Never. And if you have, I don't want to hear about it. A man in skinny pants gives his body the appearance of having female geography and that is very unappealing to me.
I like men who look like men. Sure, if you're skinny, you can look like a young man. That's fine and even better than fine in some cases. Go for it. And being male doesn't mean abandoning grace. But the characteristically male silhouette is wide in the shoulders, narrow at the hips, wider in the thigh, and not insubstantial in the calf. Skinny pants thwart all of this.
Again, if androgyny is your thing or full-on gyny, fine. Put on your skinny pants and look like a girl. That's your business. I think you'll just look like a silly little man with light (I almost said "petty") concerns.
Skinny pants + a murse under the arm? I don't even want to think about it on Happy Friday.
If a man needs, as I do, to carry things around he should opt for something like a messenger bag, as I do, or a brief case, or a book bag. But he should NOT opt for one of these short handled deals that some thread over an arm and clutch in his pit. (Note: I'm not saying you can't have a bag with short handles, you just have to carry it like a brief case. And also, it can't be floppy and big like a purse.)
Example:
William Sledd, bless his heart, is exactly the sort of man I don't want to be and have little appeal to me.
Don't get me wrong: I do appreciate when those driven to flamboyant extremes do so with a keen eye to color, pattern, and all of that. I appreciate it because these people are perfectly aware of the almost evenly divided odds that observers will love or hate them and they persist still in expressing their joie d'vivre. If you're a man who aspires to be Elle's (from Legally Blonde) best friend, then go for it. I won't stand in your way, neither will I ask you out or trust you with my taxes.
These men lack gravitas and carrying a purse under their arms like that only produces the same effect that the tiny head of a chihuahua would have jutting from a gym bag has. It is an effect that says his concerns are shallow, insipid, petty, and silly.
I can be a bit of a dandy myself and I do like a bit of whimsy when it comes to my fashion choices. If I can find a shirt with a fun dinosaur picture on it, I am likely to buy it.
I think women can carry purses in this way because women are pretty and part of the feminine mystique, if you can forgive the accidental allusion, is how they can appear both simultaneously completely exposed and vulnerable but also completely capable of crushing you and doing your taxes. The smartly dressed lady is well-composed and graceful and fanciful elements in her ensemble, things like purses, bracelets, earrings, and high heels, only serve to emphasize her femininity while not -- if used properly -- making her look vapid and silly.
A woman with her purse clutched under her arm looks serious. She is going somewhere to get something done.
A man with a purse clutched under his arm looks ridiculous. He may or may not be going somewhere and accomplishment is rather low on his list of priorities. Like I said: he lacks gravitas. Just choose a different kind of bag if you have to carry a bag.
Oh, and William, you may or may not be familiar with the pocket options available in jackets, but they are quite useful when your pants are not cut in such a way as to accommodate your necessities. (When I can't carry my messenger bag or gym bag and I can't wear a jacket, I just carry fewer things. Revolutionary!)
And since I'm ranting right now about how I think it is at times inappropriate for men to adopt the fashion choices of women, I'd like to talk about pants.
I had this video for YouTube in which I rant about those stupid skinny pants that so many hipsters and otherwise oriented males are wearing these days, but the sound was bad.
And then I saw this guy wearing a pair of slim-cut skinny pants and I filmed him and remarked about how good he looked because his pants weren't actually skinny jeans, but slim cut pants and his whole outfit was very masculine, well-fitted, and frankly brilliant. But his pants had the effect that skinny pants are supposed to have and so I had to comment on how his pants were so much better.
And then a friend of mine erased all these videos I had made, but hadn't downloaded for editing yet.
Don't know what a skinny pant is? Well, they are very tight all the way to the ankle. They're what you think a heroin junkie wears. If your pants have a zipper at the bottom so that your foot can get through the opening, then you have a pair of skinny pants, a pair of skinny pants that is VERY serious about being skinny, actually.
A slim pant may hug the thigh and be fitted to just below the calf, but leaves room at the ankle.
I don't like the skinny pant because it emphasizes the width of the hips. If you're a lady, this is fine because ladies are curvy and hips are quintessentially feminine. It also calls attention to the smallness of the ankle in relation to the rest of the leg, which is appealing on a lady. When was the last time you saw a ballet dancer with cankles? Never. And if you have, I don't want to hear about it. A man in skinny pants gives his body the appearance of having female geography and that is very unappealing to me.
I like men who look like men. Sure, if you're skinny, you can look like a young man. That's fine and even better than fine in some cases. Go for it. And being male doesn't mean abandoning grace. But the characteristically male silhouette is wide in the shoulders, narrow at the hips, wider in the thigh, and not insubstantial in the calf. Skinny pants thwart all of this.
Again, if androgyny is your thing or full-on gyny, fine. Put on your skinny pants and look like a girl. That's your business. I think you'll just look like a silly little man with light (I almost said "petty") concerns.
Skinny pants + a murse under the arm? I don't even want to think about it on Happy Friday.
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Posted by: roberto M at May 30, 2008 08:34 AM (OquT/)
Posted by: monica at May 30, 2008 08:52 AM (/DvpO)
3
Oh dear. I do suddenly feel a footwear post coming on...
Posted by: Flibbert at May 30, 2008 10:55 AM (ErOeR)
Posted by: monica at May 30, 2008 11:42 AM (/DvpO)
5
For me a man purse would simply equal "no @#*!ing way." I have some dignity. Glad to see you make the right choice. Sandals I accept on men if they wear shorts, but if you wear pants I say you should wear closed toe shoes. I am no fashion expert but that is what I find acceptable. I wear pants throughout the year because I really don't like the way shorts look on men. I associate it with children's clothing for some unknown reason.
I don't know about you but I have only buy another pair shoes I associate with purpose. There is my shoes I wear around town for general tasks. The other shoes I have are designed around tasks. My Capezios are for dancing, my Acopas are for climbing, my boots for winter icy sidewalks, etc. That is just my perspective on shoes.
Posted by: Andrew Baker at May 30, 2008 11:49 AM (FePMz)
6
But uhm in my experience, skinny jeans are designed in such a way that only tall, very skinny, square shaped girls with no ass can wear them and look good. There is no way a girl like me could even get a pair on. For serious. And if you have seen my videos am I perfectly average shaped and sized lady. Skinny jeans, are in effect designed for women shaped like skinny 14 year old, mostly-prepubescent, boys.
Posted by: Marnee at May 30, 2008 01:47 PM (/lqv4)
7
I don't object to sandals and pants, really, but in an amazing coincidence I was actually talk to my trainer about the shorts thing on Wednesday.
I tend to think shorts aren't really for grown men either, but I bought a few pairs that I think to be of the right length, so I will try to remember to wear them where it is "appropriate" according to social norms.
My view of shoes is far more broad. I have casual shoes and dress shoes and then I have special activity shoes. Special activity shoes are the ones designed for some specific purpose. Casual and dress shoes are so designated by their aesthetics and are chosen by the same.
I tend to think shorts aren't really for grown men either, but I bought a few pairs that I think to be of the right length, so I will try to remember to wear them where it is "appropriate" according to social norms.
My view of shoes is far more broad. I have casual shoes and dress shoes and then I have special activity shoes. Special activity shoes are the ones designed for some specific purpose. Casual and dress shoes are so designated by their aesthetics and are chosen by the same.
Posted by: Flibbert at May 30, 2008 02:08 PM (ErOeR)
8
Marnee, that is certainly a look that SOME women want when they put on those jeans, but those are probably the same women who are encouraging men to wear them, too.
A well fitted pant that tapers all the way to the ankle is perfectly acceptable for average ladies, too, but you have to mind your proportions when choosing patterns, colors, and tops to match.
And everyone needs an ass.
A well fitted pant that tapers all the way to the ankle is perfectly acceptable for average ladies, too, but you have to mind your proportions when choosing patterns, colors, and tops to match.
And everyone needs an ass.
Posted by: Flibbert at May 30, 2008 02:11 PM (ErOeR)
9
This is a fascinating discussion.
Marnee, I'm totally with you on the skinny pants. No. Way. In. Hell. They look good on some people and not on me and that's all there is to that!
But I'm fascinated with this take on shorts -- I love men in shorts. Especially khakis and especially with Teva type sandals. Most men do not have fat legs -- I like seeing a nice pair of legs (man or woman) in shorts. So... what gives?
Marnee, I'm totally with you on the skinny pants. No. Way. In. Hell. They look good on some people and not on me and that's all there is to that!
But I'm fascinated with this take on shorts -- I love men in shorts. Especially khakis and especially with Teva type sandals. Most men do not have fat legs -- I like seeing a nice pair of legs (man or woman) in shorts. So... what gives?
Posted by: monica at May 30, 2008 04:50 PM (/DvpO)
10
I'm trying to get over it, but usually when I see a man wearing shorts -- off the beach or outside of the gym -- I think he looks like a little boy or a tourist.
Of course, context is everything. One should always where clothes befitting the occasion. Shorts at dinner would be sick and wrong.
And Teva sandlas? *sigh* I REALLY need to write a post on this topic.
Of course, context is everything. One should always where clothes befitting the occasion. Shorts at dinner would be sick and wrong.
And Teva sandlas? *sigh* I REALLY need to write a post on this topic.
Posted by: Flibbert at May 30, 2008 05:04 PM (ErOeR)
11
I'm sorry, screw the murses, can we please discuss this WHOAman that is hosting her own youtube show? I hate you for making me watch that. And now I'm watching all her other ones.
Train.Wreck.
Posted by: Britton at May 30, 2008 07:52 PM (6IYPv)
12
You didn't know about William Sledd before this? He's a mess but he is right sometimes.
Posted by: Flibbertigibbet at May 30, 2008 08:53 PM (vHVEb)
13
Don't dis Tevas. I wear them myself. They are good for outdoor sporting activities. But I live in CO, not NYC, you know 
Posted by: Monica at May 31, 2008 07:53 AM (/DvpO)
14
*sigh* I would probably just wear shoes for those activities, but I am more flexible about Tevas than some.
Crocs, on the other hand, are absolutely unforgivable.
Crocs, on the other hand, are absolutely unforgivable.
Posted by: Flibbert at May 31, 2008 08:21 AM (vHVEb)
15
Haha. Yes, Crocs are gross.
For better comfort and a better look, Chacos are actually better than Tevas. I'm afraid I must depart with you on this point. When you are hiking or dog walking in the summer, Chacos or Tevas are far superior to hiking boots. I don't want my feet encased in sneaks or boots during the summer, even at 60 degrees.
However I can understand why people do not wear these in the south. Because those chiggers are a total bitch.
Posted by: Monica at May 31, 2008 03:53 PM (/DvpO)
16
(And owning these also eliminates having to own a pair of water shoes)
Posted by: Monica at May 31, 2008 03:56 PM (/DvpO)
17
Chacos are also abominations like Tevas and Crocs.
When I worked construction, I wore boots out in 100+ degree weather and it was fine. It was the labor I had a problem with. Otherwise, sneakers are totally fine. I don't have a problem with my feet being encased, though.
I understand why people choose to wear these things; I just think they look hideous.
When I worked construction, I wore boots out in 100+ degree weather and it was fine. It was the labor I had a problem with. Otherwise, sneakers are totally fine. I don't have a problem with my feet being encased, though.
I understand why people choose to wear these things; I just think they look hideous.
Posted by: Flibbertigibbet at May 31, 2008 04:42 PM (vHVEb)
18
If you substitute fanny pack for murse in the video it's exactly like watching a video from the early 90s! The hairstyle. The music. It all fits so perfectly.
Posted by: Daniel W at May 31, 2008 11:52 PM (SuzzA)
Posted by: Flibbert at June 01, 2008 07:12 AM (vHVEb)
20
Wow, if you think men that carry bags around are gay, you should come to Japan. It is rarer to find a guy that doesnt carry a bag. Actually I find it kind of ungodly to carry around a huge backpack like most Americans do. Theres nothing funny or gay about carrying a bag when you are a guy, people just dont do it in America, so you are not used to it. Get out of your shell and see the world.
Posted by: GanonV at June 01, 2008 08:48 AM (Sfh5R)
21
I didn't say that I think they're gay. I said that they lack seriousness. As a gay man, I'd consider it strange to describe something I refuse to do as "gay."
And if you read my comments on my post about shorts, you will see that I acknowledge that fashion decisions are largely the result of custom and context.
If you're going to visit my blog, I do first recommend removing your head from your ass.
Further, observing an entire country of people who think something is not likely to change my opinion on any given topic. This extends to murses as well as plans to protect the Earth from alien invasion using giant robots.
And if you read my comments on my post about shorts, you will see that I acknowledge that fashion decisions are largely the result of custom and context.
If you're going to visit my blog, I do first recommend removing your head from your ass.
Further, observing an entire country of people who think something is not likely to change my opinion on any given topic. This extends to murses as well as plans to protect the Earth from alien invasion using giant robots.
Posted by: Flibbertigibbet at June 01, 2008 05:40 PM (vHVEb)
22
So you think messenger bags are NOT murses? I thought they've always been classified as murses. I have two large, simple, and unadorned leather messenger bags--one black, one brown--that I wear with the strap across my chest and the bag behind my butt. I would never carry it under my arm with the strap hanging on one shoulder like a woman's purse. I like to carry my laptop in it so that I can get away with calling it a "laptop bag". But I personally would never wear the tote bags in Sledd's video, other small hand-purses with long thin straps, and bags that have flashy ornaments and bold colors and patterns.
Posted by: Tom Rexton at June 01, 2008 06:06 PM (lRQG+)
23
No, I don't count messenger bags as "murses." I suppose some people might call them murses, but messenger bags have a long utilitarian history that I think excuses them.
At any rate, you can at least wear them like you have some reason to have them and not because you need to carry extra cologne, sunglasses, and foundation.
At any rate, you can at least wear them like you have some reason to have them and not because you need to carry extra cologne, sunglasses, and foundation.
Posted by: Flibbert at June 01, 2008 07:36 PM (vHVEb)
24
I think it is great when boys can pull off the whole murse thing. I think it requires a very special recessive kind of masculinity. We could even call this quality mursculinity.
Posted by: John David at June 02, 2008 03:12 PM (ErOeR)
25
The Time: Yesterday Morning
The Task: Make a Quick Run to the Post Office, Stop By the Hardware Store for Extra Power Saw Blades, and Call Back a Close Friend
The Challenge: Accomplishing This Task While Wearing Shorts with No Pockets and in a Climate That's Too Warm for a Jacket
The Words I Found Myself Saying: "I just need a small bag to put some things in... Something small but big enough for my cell phone, wallet, money, keys... Something like a purse, but not a purse... What would that be, anyway?"
I guess what I was in need of was a "murse," but not one to carry tucked up under my armpit as seen in the video here-- one that would hang like my leather briefcase (across the chest with a wide strap) but half the size. I don't have such a bag... So I carried all this crap in my hands while I ran errands and dropped my keys at least twice before I made it home.
My vote: I am officially all for the murse as a concept-- having been in the exact moment where something murse-like would have been especially handy, I can say this first-hand. Am I all for a tuck-under-your-arm-pit murse? Um... No. My masculinity is as precarious as any man's, and I do NOT want someone, anyone, a postal employee, the check-out girl at the hardware store, to look at what I am carrying for an INSTANT and think, "Is that guy carring a purse??"
So I propose guidelines: women typically carry purses on the shoulder, not across the chest; I can draw one line by wearing my would-be murse across the chest. Women's purses often tend towards either the large (practical, put-everything-in-it-including-make-up) or the small (dainty, "I just need my money and a compact"); a murse would need to be something in between purse sizes. Purses tend towards the horizontal in shape; a murse should be vertical in orientation (i;e., taller than it is wide). Purses are often colorful and/ or flashy; a murse should be matte black or brown (leather). Purses (other than clutches) often open wide at the top; a murse should have a flap covering the top opening, like a brief case. Purses have dual thin straps; a murse should have a single wide strap.
And yet I am still not certain that I would not be accused of carrying a purse... If it is to be, er, "mistaken" for being a messenger bag, it would have to be large enough to, well, carry messages! What does that mean?? Does anyone use messengers anymore?
So here I sit. Full of theory and no murse and these damned shorts with no pockets again... Somethin's gotta give... If murses are to be "all the rage" in the fashion world, they have to distinguish themselves from their many predecessors. So far, I haven't seen this happening. Don't spit on my cupcake and call it frosting: I will know a murse when I see one and so far I ain't seen much... To my disappointment. 'Cause I could sure use a murse right now.
The Task: Make a Quick Run to the Post Office, Stop By the Hardware Store for Extra Power Saw Blades, and Call Back a Close Friend
The Challenge: Accomplishing This Task While Wearing Shorts with No Pockets and in a Climate That's Too Warm for a Jacket
The Words I Found Myself Saying: "I just need a small bag to put some things in... Something small but big enough for my cell phone, wallet, money, keys... Something like a purse, but not a purse... What would that be, anyway?"
I guess what I was in need of was a "murse," but not one to carry tucked up under my armpit as seen in the video here-- one that would hang like my leather briefcase (across the chest with a wide strap) but half the size. I don't have such a bag... So I carried all this crap in my hands while I ran errands and dropped my keys at least twice before I made it home.
My vote: I am officially all for the murse as a concept-- having been in the exact moment where something murse-like would have been especially handy, I can say this first-hand. Am I all for a tuck-under-your-arm-pit murse? Um... No. My masculinity is as precarious as any man's, and I do NOT want someone, anyone, a postal employee, the check-out girl at the hardware store, to look at what I am carrying for an INSTANT and think, "Is that guy carring a purse??"
So I propose guidelines: women typically carry purses on the shoulder, not across the chest; I can draw one line by wearing my would-be murse across the chest. Women's purses often tend towards either the large (practical, put-everything-in-it-including-make-up) or the small (dainty, "I just need my money and a compact"); a murse would need to be something in between purse sizes. Purses tend towards the horizontal in shape; a murse should be vertical in orientation (i;e., taller than it is wide). Purses are often colorful and/ or flashy; a murse should be matte black or brown (leather). Purses (other than clutches) often open wide at the top; a murse should have a flap covering the top opening, like a brief case. Purses have dual thin straps; a murse should have a single wide strap.
And yet I am still not certain that I would not be accused of carrying a purse... If it is to be, er, "mistaken" for being a messenger bag, it would have to be large enough to, well, carry messages! What does that mean?? Does anyone use messengers anymore?
So here I sit. Full of theory and no murse and these damned shorts with no pockets again... Somethin's gotta give... If murses are to be "all the rage" in the fashion world, they have to distinguish themselves from their many predecessors. So far, I haven't seen this happening. Don't spit on my cupcake and call it frosting: I will know a murse when I see one and so far I ain't seen much... To my disappointment. 'Cause I could sure use a murse right now.
Posted by: KDS at July 28, 2008 03:11 PM (8KobD)
26
Get thee to the store, man! And buy thee a messenger bag, sporty and sleek.
A "murse" defined simply as a bag that a man is carrying is an unnecessarily precise concept because anyone can carry a bag. A purse, however, is -- by definition -- a feminine article due to the way it is cut with short handles and what not. A man carrying it is just no good, and that's what I call a "murse."
So, buy yourself a masculine bag and carry it like a man and worry no more about living the nightmare of being caught carrying a murse.
And, yes, people do still use messengers.
A "murse" defined simply as a bag that a man is carrying is an unnecessarily precise concept because anyone can carry a bag. A purse, however, is -- by definition -- a feminine article due to the way it is cut with short handles and what not. A man carrying it is just no good, and that's what I call a "murse."
So, buy yourself a masculine bag and carry it like a man and worry no more about living the nightmare of being caught carrying a murse.
And, yes, people do still use messengers.
Posted by: Flibbertigibbet at July 28, 2008 03:34 PM (ErOeR)
27
I think you are all talking about what I call a handbag. I have one. It is a large, black leather arrangement with brass fittings and it contains Everything (including what I call a purse, which is a container for small change). I bought the handbag in Chicago in the year 2000, and I know it will last forever. From time to time I oil it. As a woman, I can't rely on having pockets in my clothes, so I depend on this handbag. It's heavy.
William Sledd should not be.
William Sledd should not be.
Posted by: Valda Redfern at July 28, 2008 05:51 PM (gVjbR)
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